Manchester Select Board, Oct. 19, 2026

Okay, I will call to order the uh October 19th meeting of the uh Manchester Select Board as a convenience to the public. This meeting is available electronically via the Zoom link uh for viewing and participation and in the event of any technology failure the meeting will be continued in person. Uh first concern all who are capable please rise for pledge of allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Thank you.

>> Okay. Busy meeting tonight, but I'm optimistic things will move right along. Um, any public comment on non-aggenda items out there? >> No, we have a special guest here, Dante, uh, from the local scouts doing a project on local government and he's >> great paying attention today. Want to give him a shout out for being here. >> Welcome. >> Welcome. Open your mouth. That's good. And this meeting is available on a recording if there's anything you miss. So, not a problem. Good. Okay. Uh, chairman's report. There is no chairman's report. How about the um action items?

>> Yes, sir. >> Okay. Action item B. Vote to approve the special town meeting warrant and the special town election warrant and send to the constable for public posting. At least I assume that's the the election warrant that goes to the council. Both both. >> Yes. >> Okay. And we have both documents that >> I have printed copies if you don't. Yeah. Is the uh tell me anymore. This is the >> first picking one of each.

>> I I have a couple of questions on these art one on the article five and apparently I had one on article four one on article five on article six. >> Yeah. >> So you want to kind of we'll take these in order. >> Sure. So, article one is amending the general bylaws. The annual town meeting start time. Our bylaws currently say that annual town meeting will start at 7 o'clock in the evening. Since COVID, we've we've uh predominantly started at 6:30. The law doesn't require you to have a starting time in the general bylaws. So, this amendment just strikes the start time from the bylaws and that's dictated in the future by the select board. Uh, article two is paying down um some

some of our existing debt related to the uh >> water meter >> water meters. Uh so this is a $192,65 payown. Um article three is >> question on article two. Is this the first payown? >> No, it was the second. >> This is the second. >> So a similar amount. This is the Yes. Fairly similar. And then we have another pay down uh we'll have another payown at the annual town meeting and then we go to long-term um bond on the on the rest. >> Total being one and a half something like that. >> Yeah, I think so. >> Okay. So, we're we're done with 400 of

that. Something like that. >> We will be once we're done. Yeah. >> Okay. Thank you. Article three is uh paying the remaining amount for the fire engine. Uh we previously put um 300,000 into our fire engine replacement fund. >> We did not at the last annual town meeting and expected to do uh a double amount at the upcoming annual town meeting. However, the production of the fire truck has sped up which is good. We'll be taking it by the end of the year, but that means we have to pay we have to come up with the rest of the money sooner. So, this is $710,927

um of free cash combined with the 300,000 from that we already deposited into the replacement fund for a total of 1,10,927. >> Got a a question in general. Do you happen to know what the balance of the whole fire engine fund cont? >> Well, that's a point of discussion. >> Yes. >> When we're done with this, what's the next scheduled big piece of equipment? >> It's it's we're probably about 10 years out on on a big piece of equipment with the fire department. Uh, so we talked a little bit at the finance committee meeting about do we take a break from putting money into the replacement fund

or do we maybe put smaller amounts every year leading up to it. Uh, so it's a point of discussion for April. >> Yeah, but we got a a ways to >> we have a we have some time. We could we could take a break for a couple years and then it's all dependent on how much we want to set aside leading up >> to the next purchase. >> Continue to grow. >> Well, this is Yeah, that >> we got a limited amount of place to put for. >> Well, my that's the other question. What are we doing with this? Are we uh declaring the other fire engine surplus? Are we going to sell it off? Uh the fire engine that this is going to replace will move down into our reserve which is currently filled with a fire engine we

got from Lynfield for $100. That fire engine will be surplus. So it's just a trickle down more than 100 bucks. We're gonna try >> 125 market. >> Jake Jake Chief McNeely did a great job at securing that one for us. >> Don't get them any cheaper than that. >> But it's it's really not. It's on its last uh >> wheels. >> On its last $125. We can keep it for the free. Yeah, >> I don't know if it'll >> gas to fill it up would cost more than the the value of the of the engine probably would use whatever. >> Just trying to think creatively.

>> Okay. I don't I know what the fire engine expectations are in general life expectancywise the uh EMT the medical you know our ambulances that have a similar life expectancy. >> I thought they were like 20 years or something. >> I mean those go a lot far the fire engines go nowhere in general. Um they that's untrue. >> Well, they go they go out I know what the medical calls. >> No, no, no. They go out and around to make sure that every street is open and they do that very regularly. >> So, they go down every street at least with the ladder truck. >> Okay. I'd have to double check. I I don't think that the ambulance has as much of a life expectancy.

>> I was just curious about that. >> I think it's about eight or 10 years, something like that. tense probably fush a new one two years ago was on its last legs discussion for another time and then a board >> uh article four is to authorize the borrowing for the senior community center renovation project uh so for this article we we have to appropriate the full amount of the project which is 7.5 million that's the remaining amount needed to construct the project. And we have a contingency in here uh that we will not uh borrow or expend uh any of the funds until the Prop 2 and

a half question is approved and until $3 million in gifts or donations is raised. So I heard the conversation at the finance committee and I agreed with their um recommendation that the any grants we get should apply to reducing taxation and not >> donations agree with that. I think that and I would like to reinsert grants. I think that uh what that does is that just adds more time on the other end and it's not to diminish the fact that we are still going to attempt to raise $3 million. Okay. So, I'd rather get the money up front so we can get started with the

much sorely needed and waited for uh senior center and trust that the citizens of Manchester and our volunteers in some cases uh will continue to set that $3 million goal and we're just uh just I think it sends a bad message to the the seniors. and sends a bad message to potential donors as well that we're really really not on board and we're looking to throw up roadblocks to keep this from happening. >> I disagree. I think all we're trying to do is you know we can't meet our original commitment that there won't be any taxation involved in the renovation. That was our original commitment. We can't we can't meet that because the costs are much more than we thought. Um,

so I think this is just an attempt to say, "Hey, if we get a grant, taxpayers gets gets first dibs on it." >> Grants are raised by the >> by the town and not by the fundraisers. I think >> correct. >> So I I just think it's important to put some wheels back on the uh the >> I mean the other factor involved here is uh I mean we're also dealing with the finance committee here. That's their that's their >> and that's their perspective >> and in fact that was really the the crux of the issue here and we all have to be on board with the program and this was more or less >> I don't disagree but I just I think that it's uh it's creating another hurdle for

this thing to be successful. >> It's it's my opinion. >> So I have a question. So, we don't know if we get grants, but if we do get a grant, is it up to the select board after the fact to apply it, or is it does it have to be part of this? >> Well, we we this contingency restricts us from moving forward with the project until 3 million is fundraised through gifts or donations. Uh, so it >> there's no other restrictions. >> There's no other restrictions. Oh, and the Prop 2 and a half question. Um, so >> even if we received a grant, we wouldn't be applying that until after the 3 million is fundraised based on the way

this is written. >> So, right now, that's >> Yeah, >> that's the way it's going to. >> But if we added back the word grants, then it would be different. >> It it could count the way it was originally written. And the reason I wrote it that way was because I I was going off the assumption that the the issue for the finance committee was protecting no more than $4.5 million hitting the tax rate. >> Correct. >> Um so I figured grants, gifts, donations as long as uh you know could count towards the 3 million. But, you know, I I heard in the finance committee meeting, I you know, there was there was varying opinions about the project, but um as

far as um voting to recommend, they ended up deferring to the following meeting this Thursday because of the word grants. And that's where, you know, thinking about that over the weekend and the likelihood of actually getting grants, which, you know, we hope there's not a ton of grants out there for these types of projects and we're trying to get as many as we can. Um, I think the value of getting the finance committee support on the on the article is is more important right now. And if we do get grants, it it still can go towards a project uh after the fact. So,

>> I mean, realistically, you're not talking a million dollars in grants. You're talking probably tens of thousands or maybe a hundred thousand, right? >> We applied for a$1 to3 million grant from the federal government. But it's very, very, you know, I those are very hard to get. Very hard to get. It's not impossible. Um, but I don't, you know, it's the odds of getting it are aren't high enough to push to include the word grants in here. That's the way I would put it. >> Yeah, that's >> And if we do end up getting it and $3 million is raised, then that's just less that you impact the tax rate by.

My let's we can think about this while we think about something else a little bit. My question is why um that um the uh funds will be applied first to the payment of the uh cost of the project in common spaces or commonly owned areas. Why not put it into our park? >> Common spaces are actually the exterior shell. >> Yes, we have to build it. >> Yeah, the common there there really there isn't really any common interior like common square footage except for the wall that divides the mason's unit and our unit. >> The rest of the common is the exterior

of the building. So you you think it'd be probably make more sense to do the outside first and then the inside. >> I think that's general standard general standards and practice >> traditionally to turn it into condominiums because currently it's not right. So do the structural stuff. >> Um >> okay I I didn't understand what that was about. Now I do think it makes sense. >> There's some there was some even last week there was some misconception as to what's common space. Well, right. >> There's no common space in the interior walls >> inside the building. Okay. So, that would then that everything the inter roofs and the >> right building envelope

>> the the multi-purpose room, kitchen and bathrooms and hallway that lead to it are part of our unit that we've agreed to share for certain amount of time throughout the year. But they are our it's our unit. >> Okay. >> Um but we did have multiple calls with bond counsel >> on looking at the uh closing documents, the master deed and all of that. And um they probably wrote this language based on based on the the elements of that agreement.

>> And I also had >> I I Okay. I still don't understand that sentence. >> Or is it the why? Like why do we need it? Yeah, it's it's um I don't see how it reduces the amount to be borrowed, which it claims to. Yes, the 3 million reduces the amount to be borrowed, but the this is talking about the whole amount the the >> borrowed. >> Yeah. And and that seven. >> Why do we need this? Why do we need these sentences? What what is it doing for us?

>> Yeah. Because it's like if we get a um rant or a gift or a donation, whatever the the only two parties that own the building are the town and the Masons. These dollars would become >> Oh, I I remember. So this was this is because of bond council. It's it it has to do with town tax dollars being paid for townowned property, >> right? >> Where the common areas and the costs associated to the construction of the common areas is in part owned by the Masons. So, what they're saying is that use the fundraising dollars to pay for the common areas first so that you don't get into any type of um

>> financing issues with using tax dollars on property that you only own. >> Okay. So the the intention is just to restrict the 3 million to or just to apply the 3 million to common areas >> since it's not really town money. >> Right. Right. That that's where that came from. And we did the math of we actually looked at the cost estimate uh separated out the total cost that is attributed to common area and then based on the um master deed and the division of the 2/3 oneird it ends up being about uh 15 of the total cost falls under the

mason's ownership. um percentage. So they said use the fundraising money for that piece first so you don't get into any issue with tax dollars being used for it. >> Okay. >> Property that you don't own 100% of. >> Understood. Whenever >> see why it's there. So we say that when you said 20 so like one and a half million bucks is really these are monies that go toward parts of the building that are >> it's unnecessary. It's an extra protection. Yeah, >> because people this is the first time anybody's doing this. That's it's unnecessary, but I get it. >> I mean, a lot of the language that we get back from bond council is seems to be over complicated and

>> yes, >> uh the other the other um conversation I had with legal is on the ballot on the ballot vote. Um, we under municipal finance law, we cannot include the contingency on the Prop 2 and a half question, but we can include it in our special act ballot question. So, you'll see it there. Um, but you won't see it in the prompt two and a half question. >> Oh, we're still at the point where we have to have two questions for this one article. We try to address that later in this. >> I saw that. Yeah. >> But but we have to wait for the attorney

general to >> Yes. >> Bless it before we can. >> Yeah. >> Same as it was the last election. Mhm. >> You'll also notice on the next article, which is the school borrowing, we don't have a ballot uh special act question for that because that is the the district is doing the borrowing, not the town. So, the special act doesn't apply. >> That one I don't understand is in the middle of the bottom third of the big paragraph. uh any grant that the district may receive from the MSBA for the project shall

shall not exceed the lesser of um 36 NA4100s or the approved amount from the MSBA. Uh I assume that the grant in question is the MSBA grant. >> Yes. >> So wouldn't If they gave us more money than 38%, would we have to give it back? >> I think that's the maximum they give. So, >> well, but >> basically, we don't know what they're going to give us. I understand the minimum is what I see written here. >> A maximum and no minimum. >> Just a M because MS that would be MSBA's maximum to anybody, >> right? >> Okay. Um

>> well it says it shall not exceed the lesser amount either one the 36.84% or two the total maximum grant amount determined by the MSBA. >> It just >> so that's I guess that that would >> I don't see why we just don't say the total amount of the grant from the MSBA. Why do we have to bring in the 38.x? >> Yeah, it really doesn't have to. Well, this was what we tried to do here was mirror the previous articles for the previous two schools which did include this percentage. So, that was one aspect of it. >> The reason I'm worried about the 38% is I have been hearing from people, well, why aren't we getting 38% reimbursement? And the more you bring that number in,

the more people are going to say, well, what is the actual reimbursement? We have to say we don't know. Well, so that and that brings me to conversations I've had over the past week with, you know, Tony and members of the school committee and Essex Select Board. And I told everybody I'm very uncomfortable with a warrant article that does not clearly outline a not to exceed dollar amount for the town of Manchester. I understand we don't know the exact amount yet, but we heard at the last meeting there's a high confidence Um, okay. Well, if we're confident, why can't we not change the language that they put in here, but add to it to just be clear if whether it's 50 million, 51

million, just not to exceed in English. Um, so people understand. I just >> because I think your number would have to be without MSBA and >> Okay. So, that's 67 million roughly if I remember from the last meeting. 68 million. Yeah. >> Oh, 68 million. Sorry, I'm off a million. >> What's a million million friendsion between friends? I mean, the fact that we're doing this in this sequence is very troubling. And um >> normally you have your MSBA allocation before you do this. >> Yes. And so that's that's what I'm concerned about because I I tried hard to look for other, you know, regional school districts that didn't have their number before they went to town meeting.

I couldn't find any. I'm sure there's got to be some somebody. We can't be the first ones doing this, but I couldn't find them. Um I just from a financial stewardship standpoint, I think it's not good. I won't say bad, but it's not good to put a $95 million warrant article in front of the town and not know for sure what their dollar amount's going to be. I just and I I like I said I I'm not trying to surprise anybody here, but I I I communicated with the school committee in the Essex board. I can't support it as written. So this may >> I agree with you but I I don't see how you how you're getting >> this is uh what I'm handing out here is a explanation of the article that uh

>> Essex >> Essex has put together then and I edit it to be from our from the town of Manchester um that would be included in the book underneath this Warren article and this what this says is um according to calculations prescribed by the regional agreement at town Manchester will be expected to pay 66.64% 64% of the cost which is around you know and then you have in parenthesis 49,555 >> and the two numbers don't add up to 95 million >> right because these two together are going to add up to 95 million reduced by the MSBA 20 million from the the 21 million here

from the MSBA >> which is the yeah later down there >> okay >> the 299476 The one of the issues that I ran into after speaking with you Kathy was uh that MSBA wasn't going to be able to review and approve a different warrant article over by tonight. Mhm. >> Um that there are there are some variables that could imp you know what we're what the not to exceed amount is our is on our aortionment. Mhm. >> Some of the variables included in that would be not only the final

reimbursement rate, >> Mhm. >> the final project cost, the interest rate, the cost of issuance. Um >> down the road, the aortionment formula could change based on census data. >> Um once we take a bond, we it's that's the rate. >> It's set no matter whether you're >> whatever happens. Theortionment is set. a portion of it is set >> and but you're not going to bond until >> couple years out. >> Yeah. A few years out of that. So, >> and and the other you the interest rate really doesn't make any difference because this is authorizing a borrowing. It's not determining the payment. >> That's fair. But still, it seems uh we're putting the

cart before the horse and asking people to vote on this before we know what's going on. Um, so in lie of that, I'm trying to I'm trying to find a way to get to yes, and I'm not there yet. Okay. Um, what I'm worried about is the reimbursement will come in less than expected or some other variable will come in less than expected and we will be asked to be pay something more than 50 million. Okay. So what is the process for addressing that gap? If we just leave the language right here, who gets to make the decision? Do we take, let's say it's an extra two or three million, who gets to make that decision on what we do about that extra two or three million? Does it go to the school committee? Does it go to each

select board? Who who makes the who makes the decision? If there's more money needed, there's an aortionment formula. And that's >> Say that again. >> There's an aortionment formula. >> No, I understand. So if it goes over, they'll have to come back for more money. And our part would be >> that that's not >> that's not because we're approving the whole project. I'm not saying the project of 95 million changes. That number stays the same. Yeah. >> Okay. >> But what if our bill, >> okay, comes in at 52 or 53 million because maybe just the um the reimbursement isn't what we think it's going to be. Okay. So that's a $3 million gap. Who makes the decision as

to how we address the gap? >> The the gap would be assessed. There really isn't a gap because you're not voting on a number. If you set a number, then you would have the scenario you're saying, >> but the number now is 95 million. >> Right. So we're really asking the voters to >> authorize >> authorize 67 68 million. based on the >> realistically. Yes, >> that's where Okay. And I'm just slightly uncomfortable with that. So, I'm trying to find a way to put some financial boundaries so that if we do have a we don't get as much from the state as we expect, I want the school committee to come back to us. I want them to come

back to the select boards of both towns to decide what we do about it because maybe there are some options. We can we'd have everybody engaged now. everybody's paying attention. Maybe we can think get a little creative about how we address that gap. I I don't want to just leave it in the hands of the building committee to decide what to do. Or if they would commit to take the money out of contingency, use their contingency to address it. I'd be fine with that. But I don't want to get a bigger bill than than what we have. That's my concern is I don't want it to stay in that bubble, the decision-m if we don't get what we think we're going to get from the state. But if you set it as 68, you you're leaving the door open

for 17 million. >> I don't like I don't like I said, I'm I'm not in love with the 68 million. So, I'm trying to find a way to >> Right. So, say say it works out the way it's mapped out here and you're at 50 million, right? If but to come up with a number you would have to come up with that 68 million number and you're leaving the door open for the difference. >> I don't which is exactly what I don't want to do. What I'm saying is that and if I'm wrong just say I'm wrong please. But I'm the way this is worded. We are asking taxpayers to authorize $68 million in spend. And I'm trying to find

a way to put a lower financial boundary on that so that if things don't work out the way we think they're going to work out on December 9th, that we all come back together and figure out what to do about it. I don't want to leave that decision just with this the school committee and the and the building committee. I think that both town need to weigh in. >> I I I unfortunately I don't think you can do that in the warrant article itself or in the motion. Maybe maybe we could >> we could do something in the motion, but the ballot vote and the warrant article, I don't think we can make change to that. I think you could you could request that the school committee, you

know, not make that decision without consulting with the select board, but ultimately once the warrant article and the ballot vote are approved, they have the authority to move forward. >> I'm not cool with that. Unfortunately, if this taken this vote on on December 10th, I'd be fine because we'd know our numbers. But with with the uncertainty of that um >> well this is the problem with doing it right now. >> Right. >> And I I'm still not clear on what the earth sha you know how the earth is going to fall apart if it was going to wait until spring but because that's when it should happen after we know our numbers. Then you go in front of the town with a $95 million you know request.

Again, I wasn't I I was not around the last two school votes. I've been assured that this is following the same process. >> Understand? But I think the world's a really different place than it was. >> More expensive place. >> It's not just a more expense and and I'm not questioning. I just want to be very clear. I support what the district is trying to do and I understand that these costs, this ridiculous number is being driven by state mandates, okay, and constru construction costs that are out of control. Okay? I I applaud them for um this is smaller than some of the other building, you know, school building projects I've seen. So, I applaud them for that. All I'm trying to do here is

find a way, if possible, to respect the taxpayers who are going to foot the bill and is there any way of um you know putting some financial boundaries on that because without that I I'm no I'm not supporting it. I mean Tony you said that you really I mean the way it's written you can't have any financial boundary and right now >> there is the 68 is is a >> 68 is the financial >> boundary or is it 74? No, it's 68 for the town of Manchester. >> If we if we get no reimbursement from the state, >> if we get no reimbursement, >> it's like 6768 for the town of

Manchester. Everybody says they're confident we're gonna >> only pay. >> I don't trust >> everybody. >> I don't trust the state and I, you know, I'm just not in a position of trust right now. >> So, I'd like to get a real dollar amount. Like, we can't do that. I think we should wait till the spring. That's that's how I feel >> and I think the project should go forward but I think we should wait till the spring. >> You know, as much as this bothers me and you know how much it bothers me, >> I'm agreeing with Kathy on this one. Uh you know, I think that the MSBA is driving I thought my understanding was that we're driving this to move this along quicker than it should have

happened. Right. And my understanding was that this school and and you you know correct me because you've been involved with this a lot was this was supposed to be looked at sometime at the retirement of the high school debt. Right. the the the hope on the part of the town governments >> was that the Essex school would would happen so that the bonds would be set um after the high school bonds would but that was not the opinion of the school district and as it turns out it's the school district that's driving this >> well once the school district puts the MSBA in motion that's it there's no >> there's pulling the plug on that.

>> And to be honest with you, the other reason I favor the spring is because we'll have a more holistic picture on our financials. I thought, you know, last week's um Bincom meeting was supposed to get us a little more data on, you know, how do we absorb this? I I watched the tape and I'm not sure I really learned more. So, I feel a little uncomfortable with that. And the third reason I'd love to wait till the spring is I I don't remember us talking at all about the increase in the operational costs of a larger building and fields. So we you know we've had some struggles with the school budget over the past few years. This is going to increase that operational budget to no end. You know

it's going to happen. You get a bigger building more fields that you're going to your costs are going to go up. We haven't even had that conversation yet. So, like I said, if I could I'm just looking for something here. And if I could get some type of financial boundary, I could probably, you know, swallow and, you know, zip it up here and just go with it. But without something giving here, I I can't I I just think we we need more specific data and uh I think the spring will give us a better holistic view on on everything. I don't know where the timeline of this whole project goes given another six months. >> Five months or >> No, six months. >> Six months. Oh, it's umund

isn't a certain number of days after um >> Well, if the article fails, >> the article fails. >> The article fails, it they have 120 days to >> take it back up, >> right? So, we may have to have a a town meeting a little earlier than planned. >> I don't know. There are other towns. Uh, I mean, all of these projects go through a process where here's here is the expected reimbursements, and I'm just wondering if there are projects out there. Oh, we thought it was X and we're off by 50%. >> I I tried to find any school district which went forward on a town vote without knowing their MSBA number, and I couldn't find any. I tried. There may be one out there. I'm not saying there

isn't, but I tried to find it and I couldn't. I think you know Hamilton Wenham was an elementary school recently. They got their number in February I think in time for their Springtown meeting and so they had months to kind of talk to people, educate people. We're trying to push this thing through and we don't have our number yet. So I just I'm not comfortable and and for $95 million, you know. >> Let me ask you this. If the MSBA was zero, would you vote this thing down? I would ask us to go back to the table. Yeah. And and just I think part of our issue is that we've all been asleep honestly in Manchester. We're going to be footing the biggest part of the bill and most of us quite

honestly have been to been asleep. I went I went to a couple of meetings, took a tour, but you know, it hasn't been top of mind and I think it would be a wakeup call and I think we have people's attentions and if god forbid we didn't get any reimbursement from the state, I think we could enlist the very smart people of Manchester to help us figure this out. Um I just I I certainly don't expect the state to give us nothing. So I'm not I'm not suggesting that. But to play devil's advocate, >> I mean the 95 million is not going away. So >> yeah, I don't think it I don't think it is, but I just think there's there's way you can there's ways you can approach projects to >> um smooth things out, do things

differently. Um it's a big number, but it can be managed. >> Pam's comment was that if the reimbursement rate changes, it'll be within a tenth of a percent. >> I that that was a comment. I agree. And that's why I felt very comfortable asking for a not to exceed. I I didn't and I don't think that's unreasonable. Her confidence level was very high uh on the percentage. So that's why I thought it was reasonable to just do the math. Put it in there. >> I think we could continue. So I'm trying to find a way of because we have to vote on the warrant tonight, >> right? And the issue, the one of the primary issues with this request was that MSBA wouldn't be able to review and approve of it in a short

time and turn it around within a couple days. Um, so we could potentially continue the conversation as part of a motion, you know, as far as what the motion is going to be at town meeting to maybe include that type of contingency. But otherwise, if we don't if we don't include this in the warrant tonight, Essex is moving forward and we wouldn't be. >> Where would that put us? >> It just means we vote and we have 120 days to have another, you know, bring up our town meeting. >> Well, I mean, it still depends what happened at town meeting, but >> depends what happens at the town meeting. But, I mean, Essex is getting a pretty good deal here. I mean, um, you know, their their costs are quite

>> Where are they where are they at in this process? They don't >> under for our school district. >> Yeah, without a doubt. Yeah. >> I'm sorry. Overcharge. >> Well, I don't know. I I just think it's it's a very sweet deal. >> They are paying more than they can afford >> their tax bill. >> I don't really agree with that. >> I don't agree with that. >> They're Look at their tax building. 20 something million dollars. Yeah. I I can't imagine Essex saying no. I mean, it's a real sweet deal. >> Okay. >> For them. So, >> board has gone through this process. >> Yeah. >> And they're >> they're putting this explanation from

what I >> Yeah, they would have the same copy, I think. >> But I I >> they've also contributed to two schools here in Manchester. They have, you know, I I want to be mindful of that. And I think it would put the two towns and the district in a very awkward position if Essex moved forward with the question in November and we didn't. >> It would certainly be ugly if we didn't endorse it. We meaning this the select board didn't endorse it. >> Um >> if the voters turn it down, the voters turn it down. That happens. >> Yeah. And and again, I'm not opposed to putting uh a warrant with financial an article on the warrant that has some financial boundaries. That's all I'm

asking for are the financial boundaries. I think it's just bad. >> And 68 doesn't do it for you. >> Pardon me. >> 68 million doesn't do it for >> um no. You can build a whole elementary. >> Is there a number that does? >> Ult ultimately >> it's the motion at town meeting that rules. the article just notifies >> people of what's right of what's coming up. >> So if we can >> I think we we should continue the conversation with the school district and and the select board members of >> Essex and school district here on the call. >> It seems like they think this was a pardon me. >> Oh, she has her hand raised. >> Oh, okay. Okay, Lindsay, he's up there

somewhere. >> Hi. Can you hear me? >> Yeah. >> Hi. Sorry I can't be there in person. Um I guess I just I didn't hear what you were just discussing, but I did just want to say that um at the end of the day, you're approving articles for the voters to decide upon, not whether or not these should be passed. So, um I think ultimately yes, it would be on the school committee to educate the voters to communicate about those boundaries that you're asking for, Kathy, which I totally understand. My understanding is that like this really isn't within our hands. It's in the hands of the MSBA. Um and that this is

uh the MSBA requires a very very rigorous process to get us through this to get to this point. They're not trying to give us more money than, you know, we need and absolutely would align with the educational program just like the towns aren't trying to, right? So, um I do I know I can speak to the fact that your concerns were discussed at length, Kathy. Um and we hear you, but it's just literally not possible um from the state granting authority who are also going to give us $20 million. So, I would just say the implications of us as Manchester not putting this on our warrant and Essex does put it on their warrant, I would ask this committee to think very deeply about what that would

mean uh moving forward for our district and the relationship between our two towns. Um, was there a specific question that I can try to answer? I'm not the superintendent, but >> No, it's just like I said, I I think in in terms when you're talking about this type of dollar amount to have um such a huge gap between the not to exceed that's percentage-wise addressed in the warrant um versus what we think we're going to get. That's it's just too unclear. Um it's too big of a gap. Um we have a responsibility to be the integrators. So each warrant article, anybody can request a warrant article and certainly the school committee is

well with within their purview to request this type of article. Um, and I support the project. I want to say that again. I do support the project. It's just that we have a responsibility to take all of the input from everybody who are asking us for funding and try and integrate that into a warrant that makes sense for the taxpayer. And I just don't think it's unreasonable for us to be when we're talking about this type of money to be really clear how much are we asking for because this is going to add >> well there is yeah with all due all due respect there is a number in the article it's high but this is also a high price tag which the voters will need to weigh. So it's not that there it's not an

unlimited um amount that voters are approving. Um I also I think Essex's strategy and I as Tony has mentioned they have similar concerns but their strategy has been to put language um is it in the motion Tony or on the warrant itself or in how the warrant is explained to voters um to clarify and to be as specific and clear with voters as possible. Um >> that's and I I pass that out to the select board members, Lindsay. And even that even that could probably use a little bit more uh some some more clarity. We have until the end of this week to to deal with that. Um

>> if it would make you feel better, Kathy, I could work with you on that language. The other question I asked um which maybe you can answer is if the state does not come back and reimburse us for as much as we think they're going to uh we think uh Manchester's bill would be 50 million based on the expected reimbursement but if they don't who makes the decision on how we let's say that Manchester's bill turns into 53 million okay who makes the decision ision on how we address the gap between the 50 and the 53 million. >> Well, you have the you do have the ceiling, right, with the the 60 I'm

sorry, I don't have the exact numbers in front of me. 68 million. You have your ceiling. Um, and then as far as that gap, I don't actually know procedurally who makes that decision. I would say that as as school committee members um there hasn't been a cash grab historically that school committee school committee is trying you know we we work with both towns we have reps with both towns. We want both towns to to and residents of both towns to um understand that we're we're acting responsibly and financially responsibly like with with the money. So, um I guess so I guess to answer your question, so if if we could um if

>> if Manchester's bill is going to be more than $50 million, I would like the school the select I would like a commitment that the select boards of both towns will get together with the finance committee and school committee figure this out. I don't I don't want anyone to see why I think under the regional agreement that decision would have to be made along the aortionment lines. What I mean is there may need to be um there are ways that you can address the gap by using contingency funds that they have planned into the budget. Okay? You don't have to take that extra $3 million and build the taxpayers. You could use some of the contingency or scale back

certain things in the project, do a fourth phase, you know, an extra phase. There are ways to address it from a project management standpoint. You don't have to send a bigger bill to the taxpayers. And I just think when we're talking about this kind of money, um, that conversation should happen if we don't get as much money from the state as we think we're going to get. I just don't have that trust, right? >> Okay. Well, I think we have the right to do that anyway. If if if the number came up several million authorized the school committee, correct? >> They will see that. I mean, you can read the tea leaves and if you've got that much more money, there'd be a lot of taxpayers that have a question.

Certainly you would >> but >> and say what are we going to do here? Maybe maybe we do alter the project just a little bit. Three million. >> No, >> I'm just saying I don't there's nothing that forces that and I'm looking for either personal commitments or language here, you know, and the leaders who would need to make those personal commitments. I don't know. I think I think >> well in the in the capacity that I that I can make a personal commitment Kathy as a single school committee member of seven w with Pam I would be >> willing to work with you on >> that Lindsay I know you would >> y seven though >> between now and special town meeting we could

have a discussion amongst the select boards and the school committee about what the motion is going to look like at town meeting and if We can't include some ceiling in between the reimburseed amount and the non-reimburseed amount in the motion. You know, you could discuss a commitment from the school committee to not move forward without having a discussion with both boards prior. You know, if the reimbursement rate reduces by a certain amount, >> can we make it contingent on the reimbursement? >> Would love to do that. You can't >> I don't think we can change the language

in the article. >> From the discussion I had with legal about the senior center, the the very clear uh comment was that you can't include a contingency on a Prop 2 and a half override. You cannot >> on on on an article or on a motion >> an article on the >> artic the article both >> both I don't you know the uh the the specifically the ballot right the ballot is is approving the the debt the article at town meeting is authorizing um the tool to borrow.

So >> this so this may be a dumb question, but why is this not a capital debt exclusion >> because we're not doing the borrowing. This whole district is doing the borrowing. >> Oh, because of districts >> and that. So that's where the decision make once you approve this article when if it goes before town meeting and they approve it it is my understanding the school committee >> has the authority >> has the authority around all the decision making around what happens there and what I'm trying to say is I think we are paying the biggest part of the bill and I I'm not comfortable with just the school committee involved

in any decisions should the financial figures change. I think we need to engage. The select board of ethsics needs to engage and I can't find language or a forcing function other than to say no to make it happen. I I I'm open to all ideas. >> I guess I guess another question I have is we're going to have to be careful about if somebody wants to amend this on the floor. >> Well, that's what I'm saying. be able to really >> you if we can be proactive here. >> I mean, whatever we do, but if some resident wants to amend this on the floor, >> there's nothing stopping them. >> They're really not going to be able to, >> right? Well, they can't they can whatever they want.

>> Certain guard rails, but yeah, there's not there's a lot they're not going to be able to do. Let me just correct my previous comment that the contingency that you can include in this article which is included in here is that the school cannot borrow unless both towns approve of the debt exclusion. That's the contingency that's in there. But it's not a contingency sealing amount in between the reimbursed rate and the non-reimbured rate. I think that's what Kathy's really getting at is >> uh if the 21% reduces down to 20 19% and your 49 million goes up to 52 53

>> you know >> the school committee does have the authority at that point to continue to move forward and that would be shifted as part of the >> bill and and just like I said if this was 2016 honestly I probably wouldn't be pushing this hard on this, but this is a different world. And what's happening, the the federal and state, what whether they're grants or, you know, whatever, they are in a state of flux in many different areas. And whether it's municipalities or nonprofits, they're getting knocked all over the place, surprised out of nowhere, thinking they're going to get x amount of money, and all of a sudden that money goes away. It's it's just a different world than it was when

Memorial was built. And so I just I'm trying to protect the taxpayer here as much as possible. Um, and I just >> can we can I just make a a quick suggestion that I I do think the town of Essex likely shares your concern, right? Like what is if there is a $3 million difference? Like what is going to be done with that money? So, can we separate out the warrant article that's before you that the state requires in order to give us the the $20 million or uh whatever it ends up being? and can we separate that out from the process that we can undertake collaboratively together between now and town meeting because at the end of the day we don't have control over the language if we want to go through this MSBA

process and get these millions of dollars of grant money. Um, and so we we do need to get this done, but then also and I I can say it's um it's my understanding that like Essex would certainly be willing to to have this conversation and probably curious about the answer as well and the school committee certainly would be willing to engage with you to make sure that like we can all feel comfortable walking into town meeting with what's being asked and and ultimately again what is being put before the voters. ers and letting them weigh in. >> Is the school district willing to hang their hat on 20 million? >> What do you mean by hang your hat?

>> Yeah, the reimbursement. Are they very are they confident in giving that number to the public? >> I mean, I I'll repeat what Tony said earlier. I believe um Pam has repeatedly said she doesn't expect it to shift more than a a couple percentage points either way. Is that right, Tony? >> She said a tenth of a percentage point. >> A tenth of a percent. >> Yeah. >> Again, I'm not the superintendent. I don't have all those numbers right in front of me. Um I came on this meeting to to just like see what your all all your concerns were and like make sure voters are as informed as possible. Um going >> one last question. I'm not sure if you caught it when I asked it earlier, is

that we hadn't talked at all about the increased in operational costs. Have you guys talked about that at all? >> Uh, I haven't seen that, but that doesn't mean that it's not in the works with Pam and the SB. I'm not on the SBC. Um, we do have a school committee meeting tomorrow night, and so I will certainly raise that um as something that we need to make sure that we're communicating to voters ahead of town meeting. Um, >> thank you. Yeah, because I mean, normally when you look at a project like this, the the total cost would be, you know, we were doing this commercially, you'd have a total cost number, not just the cost of construction, you'd have and your increase in operational cost would

also be communicated. So, um, that that would be a good data point for I'm I still haven't got a >> All right. But but the fact is is the copy the way this reads is what we've got article-wise. >> It's it's >> that doesn't change. >> This is this is what Yeah. The motion the motion can get pushed around over the next month. >> Yep. And there's certainly any type of educational material or any type of side arrangement worked out between the select boards and the school committee. But as far as tonight goes, this is the article language that's been blessed by MSBA and bond council and legal counsel. Right. Now, if the motion reads

differently in whatever way it it comes out, how does that affect the ballot word? >> It doesn't it, you know, it can't veer off too far uh with the bot. >> So, the ballot question is number one. >> Yeah. Which is just very simple. It's just allowing to exempt from Prop 2 and a half the cost of the project. It doesn't. >> All right. So, this this is not a quantitative statement other than saying it's exact, >> right? >> So, it's really all about the town meeting. >> All about the town meeting, >> which we have some time and Essex has some time to kind of

decide, okay, how how are we going to word this? And it seems to me that at that time if the numbers change however they you know they they might change that >> won't know >> we won't know. >> We won't know. That's the problem. >> That's that's correct. But you can you can create a motion that will address that. I say let's put on the ballot from the line. Okay. The questions we have asked here will be asked at town >> meeting and the school committee had better have better answer than they have right now. With the respect to uh Lindsay. Okay. >> Yeah. >> Is that and that ultimately it's the the voters's decision >> and if they're not satisfied with the

answers they're going to get from this election from the school committee then it might be the not the outcome they want. But I think this is an educational tool for the school committee today to realize there are some serious questions that got to be asked. So, I would suggest something. Um, I agree that, you know, school committee is a duly elected board on their own and have the right to put something on the warrant. I will not be recommending that we approve it though as written. Um, I just I we we have there's no financial boundary here. So, I agree with you. Ultimately, the school committee has to make their case, but I'm trying to find a way to um ensure we protect our town from a very large expense because once

we if this thing gets approved as is, we we just lose complete control over it. That's my concern. >> And I get that and I appreciate it. Truly do. But the emails that I've been receiving, that you've all been receiving, these questions are going to be asked and they're going to be asked >> people in Manchester have woken up for sure. >> Yeah. >> And they're going to make So >> Lindsay, can I just ask Lindsay a question real quick? >> Yeah. Tomorrow, tomorrow night's school committee meeting, do you have uh this on the agenda in a way that if a member of our select board or a member of the Essex Select Board wanted to attend? It's too late to post a joint meeting, but to at least have a

conversation tomorrow night. >> I It is on the agenda that the Essex Elementary School building project approval of project budget and authorization of borrowing. Um, so I would imagine Yeah. And I would imagine like also >> would you let us talk? >> That's the problem with the question. Would you let us talk >> the school committee? >> Yeah. I'm not chair but uh there is the public comment portion at the beginning and I would imagine I know Ann you've been at many meetings and when it's timely and appropriate you have been invited to do so informally just as you guys have given me the courtesy of being able to do right now. So, um

>> Okay. >> And there's going to be What time is the meeting tomorrow night? 6:30. >> 6 >> Yeah. 6 p.m. >> Where? >> High school. >> Okay. >> The high school media commons. >> Second floor. >> Okay. Just following breadcrumbs. All right. move on to article six. >> Okay. >> Yeah. And my comment here is it seems to be two articles. >> The the the reducing the amount the the figure that requires a ballot vote is one thing and it's entirely in our control.

Um the whole the rest of it about changing um chapter 270 is the town the we're asking the town to give us permission to ask the state to do something for us and I I think they'd be easier to discuss separately. Is this gone through have you looked at I mean is that even legal to have two separate questions on one two separate issues on one ballot you >> yes I can assure you everything I'm presenting >> no I'm just saying my understanding we have two gun control and rent control >> when we had our joint when we had our >> it is the same subject it's the same subject matter when we when we spoke about this at the joint meeting with the

finance committee this is where we talked about um you know the the core issue we were trying to solve is eliminating the two ballot questions for the same project like we see >> on this on the senior community center that requires a home rule petition to amend the special act. >> Yep. >> The other thing that came up was is a million dollar is a million dollars too low. >> Uh should we increase that to five million? That is in our general bylaws. So to fix those two problems, you have to amend the general bylaws and do the home rule petition. So I ask >> either just doing the home roll petition will get rid of the second val.

>> Yes. >> So that solves that problem. The other question which is quite in my mind separate is at what point does a non two and a half exemption have to go on the ballot? The dollar threshold is >> the dollar threshold. Yes. And that that seems to me to be quite a different question than getting rid of the second ballot by requirement. Can we split this >> into two articles? >> I I think if I recall a conversation at the finance committee, they were happy to have it combined into one because I think they thought the two were too confusing. If I remember single just get it all done at once. >> Yeah. I mean I I don't have a dog in a

fight. >> I don't care. Yeah. Would it be possible to separate the two? >> Absolutely. >> I think it's I think it would be much it would be easier to explain particularly if the first part came second. >> First we explained we've got the situation where we're voting twice on the same question. >> Let's fix that. >> Yeah. And now we've got this limit that was set in 1972 and we need to raise that and just discuss them as separate. >> That makes sense. >> Okay. Yeah, I could do that. >> Okay. >> Come back with a >> Yeah, we can. >> I'm perfectly willing to approve this whole thing, you know, based on your

following. >> The copy really doesn't change too much. It's just that you're splitting it. >> Well, wait a minute. It's a different article. >> Are we reumbering the articles? >> Yeah. >> Right. >> So, we re reumber six to six and seven and seven becomes eight. >> That's it. Eight follows. >> No, eight follows eight. >> 67

article seven becomes Yeah, I assume article seven now becomes article eight which is the sign bylaw. >> Y talking we've gone over that. >> So how would we >> all right so >> this so that you have a final version tonight? I mean what is the proper way to do this? >> I would say um that the motion to be to move that the select board approve and sign the special town meeting warrant amended to divide article six into two articles and the special town election warrant as presented amended

article six into two articles. >> So, I can read it if you'd like. >> Yes, please. I can't read this. >> All right. >> So, moved. So, I move that the select board approve and sign the special town meeting warrant amended to divide article six into two articles and the special town election warrant as presented and be transmitted to the town clerk for posting. >> So, move second. >> Mr. Clarifies the special town election warrant does not change. >> Correct. >> Okay. It's only the uh >> uh further discussion on on these items. It was so much fun with two together. >> Jeff, >> yes. Ryan, >> yes. Ann, >> yes. >> Kathy,

>> I'm sorry. Which we're voting on just splitting it. No, we're voting on the >> the entire things, but six goes to six. Yes. >> Okay. Yes. >> And I say yes. Okay. So, I'll I'll have you I'll have I'll get your signatures tonight on the on the warrant, but I'll just amend I'll make that change >> and and attach it to the signature page. good. Um >> anyone recommendations for each of the exist what's the story on recommendations on this >> or are there I mean the finance

committee deal with that >> they already did theirs except except for the senior community center they're waiting see what the language >> on Thursday but the the finance financial >> so if you want your recommendations to be included in the book >> that's going to the printer Fridays Then we should do recommendations tonight. >> Okay. Need to >> you know we don't normally do a book for special town meeting. We're doing it this time because of the larger projects. So it's it's entirely up to you. The finance committee will have their recommendations in the book and >> Okay. probably makes sense to include your >> I I move that we approve um all articles

except article five >> second >> let's say >> was the school budget school building >> we're going to take no action what are we going to do take >> we're going to make our recommendation on town meeting four >> because that's pending seeing what's >> further commitments and discuss I think that's a very good suggestion thank you Ann was looking for a good suggestion and that's perfect thank you >> okay uh so all these do we make recommendations on all these articles or um >> yes >> does it make sense Tony I guess yes >> yes >> I I seconded what she said I did second

>> one two three four six seven and eight >> six seven and eight correct Okay, that's the uh the motion. Any further discussion on that? >> Jeff, >> yes. >> Brian, >> reluctantly yes. >> Ann, >> yes. >> Kathy, >> yes. >> And John is yes. >> And I move that we make a recommendation on article five on time. >> Second. >> Okay. Further discussion on that. >> Okay. Jack, >> yes. >> By >> Yes. >> Kathy, >> yes. And John is yes. Okay. Anything else on the town meeting more? >> I don't know.

>> Well, you thought that was a long discussion. Now we got to deal with a field. >> We have some couple of patient. >> Yes. >> People over there. Thank you. >> By the way, these meetings aren't always this spicy. So, >> just boring. Okay. >> I move that we recommend the name for the pine sheet field to be volunteers field. >> Second. >> Okay. Any further a volunteer or volunteers? >> Volunteers.

trying to find what did the uh box and rect decide on either one >> they submitted both >> one of the names submitted was volunteer >> okay then I will change my motion to volunteer >> I will second that >> okay um any any further discussion on that I mean I pulled a bunch of people and the problem with this is if you pull 10 people you get 10 opinions right >> you p 20 people, you get 20 opinions >> with two choices. This is this is tricky. >> Or you could, like I said, you could always leave it plain sweet field, but if you want to name it something else, >> I I like volunte

>> or not naming things. Could we put that in the >> We need that a year ago. You have you have your policy. We can still have because there are other things that get named. >> Oh yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> For recreational areas. >> Yeah. I'll name anything. >> I just think that if we're going to name something after a person, it ought to be a person who contributed to the project. >> And that's right. I think John said yes technically. But I think he's right. >> Yeah. That just drives you crazy. >> Okay. We have a seconded motion. motion. Any further discussion on this? >> Jeff, >> yes. >> Brian, >> yes. >> Ann,

>> yes. >> Kathy, >> yes. >> And John is Yes. Geez, that went a lot faster than I thought. >> Thank you for sitting through all this. >> Muffin's running right out of here. >> Volunteer. So, that covers the We're still waiting for a sign for Reed Park, aren't we? >> Yeah. A package deal. Is this part of the package? >> Okay. It's been changed in deals. >> I don't know if my estimate is still going to be the same, but >> Okay. Well, that's good. I just wanted to >> Yeah. >> was there yesterday and noted that. I know we were missing something. Okay. Good. >> Put it right next to the mermaid. >> Yes.

Okay. Um, so we're done with the field. The next is a discussion item. Town Administrators quarterly review.

>> And so Tony kindly did a I won't call it a self assessment. Let's say an analysis where things stand with regard to his to-do list. And I think we're in possession of all of it. And I did compare it to where he was say three months ago. Yeah, I guess in in June. I have to say in I was impressed. There were a lot of checks. >> A lot of checks. >> So, uh, questions or comments from my colleagues? concern isn't any of these things. It's that it seems to me we're getting materials on Monday much more often than

I'm comfortable with. And sometimes you hand out rather complicated things at the meeting and I would rather defer so that we have a chance to read the stuff and think about it than get something that I can't swallow while we're talking. >> I know that things change all the time, >> but >> yeah, but we can't make >> It's not like he's holding on to it and it says I think I'll give these this the minimum money, >> but it's planning. So, um >> I'm sorry. Finish your comments. >> Most of the things that we deal with are not immediately time critical. If we

have something that's coming up as time critical, it needs to be pushed up ahead of other things so that we get a chance to to read it and think about it. It's very sorry disempowering to try and make a decision on something that's a couple pages long that I got at 3:30 on the day. >> Tim, today >> Yeah, among other things. Well, so the today the only thing you got today was the ballot warrant which was subject to getting it back from legal counsel, but certainly, you know, the majority of the time I think I do get you stuff >> prior to Monday. Uh, but I can push to

get that sooner. >> Well, I want to go away for a weekend and not think about this stuff. >> I understand. I do too. Uh but I that's fine. That's well wellreceived. You know, of course, it's important that you guys get information earlier uh in the process, >> but congratulations on all of those contracts that you have got done. That's amazing. >> Still got more to do uh with the police union uh with some I I added one new one there. If you noticed Harbor Master, we do have the expected retirement uh of buying coming up. So, um >> are we going to do a search?

>> I have I haven't decided that yet. Um so, working on that. Uh the the assessors department. Um, so we have filled the full-time assistant assessor position. We've had a consult, we've had a uh retired um part-time principal assessor who's been filling that void, but unfortunately I think his time is uh is is running out. Uh he he um has reached his capped amount for retirement. He's also had some uh medical situations that may limit his

ability to come back a after the new calendar year. So, I'm supposed to be having a call with another potential fill-in opportunity. Um still have to kind of work through what's the future of that position. Are we are we hiring a full-time principal assessor? Are we hiring a retired part-time assessor? Are we maybe >> sharing with another town? >> Um, so that's that's definitely uh the the most urgent issue with that is we have tax rate needs to be set, billing going out, and then shortly after the new year, we're into abatements and >> things of that nature. So, we have we got to get someone in to help us with

that process um sooner than later, but ultimately the long-term uh direction of that position needs to be figured out. Well, these are all the personnel issues that you've been wrestling with. I mean I mean in summary I think uh in looking down everything you've done you you've worked through the hardest ones and and personnel issues are the hard things whether it's uh you know the various contracts and uh finding people and dealing with individual contracts. I think those are are are probably uh uh the toughest. I'm not saying trash is probably a close second to that. Um, and then there's the capital

projects, moving all of them along. But the the most critical things are the ones where you made I think the most progress. And I I applaud you for tackling what really was most important but also most difficult and and getting over the finish line with many of them. >> Well, I share that with the team. I mean not only even if it's unrelated to the contract specifically the amount of work that the team you know is stepping up and completing so that it gives me the time to focus on the contracts but also specific to the contracts um Andrea definitely deserves a lot of credit too. uh she I gave her so many different you know financial scenarios and analysis to

run and um you know I think she was more involved in these contract negotiations than she has been in the past and did a phenomenal job in that regard. So give her a lot of credit. >> You really I think um a lot of the team was kind of there but nevertheless I think you've knitted together a closer relationship with the team in general. >> Yeah. I would um just you know generally um I think you've done a outstanding job especially like your focus on the team building and the employee morale. I think that was something that we had spent enough time on and I can see that you know close town hall for a little day and just do a little stuff. It's it's all good. You know, it's real it's

important too. Um the I think the broad communication to the town is is something that you do very very well. And I think the trash situation uh was a good example of that. You know, um real tough situation there. And the contract negotiations um the resulting contracts are fair. The language is simplified which is simple is good. Um, I would say, you know, I kind of agree with Ann on just watch the what I call the operational excellence. We're seeing we are seeing more collateral come in late on a Monday, which we probably should. So, like you did a great job planning for the town meeting. We asked you for like a calendar meet these

dates. There should be for your regular meetings that same type of calendar. So if you need Debbie to do something or a lawyer to do something, you say, "Hey, you know, I need your answer by here so I can have the collateral to the select board by Thursday, etc." There there needs to be that tightening up, if you will. Um, and because we've been seeing a lot of old meeting minutes too for like a few years back, so I'm not sure what that's all about, but anyway. So just keep an eye on that because that stuff can get out of control and then um then things don't look so good. The other thing I would I would just mention is regarding the personnel. Ton of personnel issues. I mean, wow. Yeah, you

did a lot. Um, always search. Even if you have, you hear me talk a lot about secession planning, but secession planning is to prepare people to do a job. The search >> is good for them to interview for a job and compete. It strengthens them as leaders. Don't take that away from them. So be be careful about not doing a search is what I would say. Um and then the last thing is um I think we've talked about in the past that you know services and how we do them and whether we share things with other towns is something we need to look at. I that's really something I think we need to step up especially if we're going to be

spending $95 million on a school. that something we need to get to the top of the priority list. Um, so let's think about that. But I I Well, you're here. Thank you. >> Thank you. I think uh I think you've done an outstanding job. I mean, yeah, you can always pick at things and do things. Yeah, there's always room for improvement, but looking over all the stuff and you had a tough quarter here. So, I'm very appreciative of the work you've done. I think you've really built a team. You've really built your team since you've been here and um I just want to thank you for your efforts and I I would give you a grade

of A+ personally. So, thank you. >> Thank you. Appreciate that. I just want to remind you that I didn't vote for it. Um, >> and he was wrong. Why? Why did you for the most part

again I don't say it lightly the team that I walked that I was welcomed by here we as a community are ex I can't express how lucky we are to have the staff that we do and the talent that's here in every respective department is off the charts and the way that the team gets along with each other is off the charts. It makes my life a lot easier and I know from talking to other town administrators, the challenges that they face, I've been in another community, I've faced those challenges um that it's exceptional here. So it really that my success is because of their because of

the team that's here. >> To that point I think that we had a we you walk into a great situation that's for sure but we've solidified that and >> taken it to the next level >> and yes so again didn't think it was going to happen but it did. So it did. >> On behalf of all of us here we want to say thank you. Thank you. >> Because the fact is is that you make our life a little easier. >> There's no question. >> Yes. >> Because these questions and issues come up and you're well informed on the issues as to this is what the story is. So we try to come prepared and I think for the most part most of us do but you're always prepared

and uh I can't over >> Thank you. Thank you very much. All right. On the liaison, anybody got anything that happened the past month? Who wants to start? >> I have a situation. Well, I won't >> Oh, that's that. >> I have a situation going on. >> Uh, Essex Tech with our lottery allocations for next year. >> Chase, huh? >> Yeah, there's a bunch of them. But so they have right now on the table they have six different plans of how they using different parameters to come up with allocations for each city and town

but it puts us anywhere from 8 to three which three is unacceptable. >> Eight to three per year. >> So we can only have eight. We'd lose five slots is what you're saying. >> Right now we're in >> we're not So right now I'm in talks with the superintendent, the people on the admissions committee, the chair of the board of the school committee trying to come up with a number that works for us. We really don't need 10, but three is unacceptable. >> So,

I don't know where we're going to end up, but I am spending some serious time working on this situation. So, right now, we had an allocation of 10 last year and right now we're at six. So, six shows me that our need is more than we've realized over the years. But maybe it's not 10. Maybe it's, you know, maybe there's another number there. >> They gave us 10. And how many did we fill? >> Six. >> Filled six. Okay. >> Well, we had So, >> we had a couple of kits. We filled 10 lottery slots, but we had a

couple kids back out last. So, like I kind of explained to you before that, >> but six shows there's a need that that more than historically what we've ended up with. So, so I'm working on it. >> Yeah, I think that's grown. My my recollection has generally been been in the 12 to 15 area across all classes. >> Right. So six would put us at 24, which >> I mean, and that's not even to say we're going to put six every year, but >> three is just slamming the door on us to give other cities and towns. And the problem is >> everybody who's on this committee is from a city or one of the bigger cities or towns. So there's really not a lot of

representation from the smaller towns. So that's another situation I'm working on. But they're going to vote on this next month. So, >> it's a timesensitive situation. >> And I know when they went to the 10 that we got, the the bigger cities got hit kind of hard with their allocations. >> Well, originally they wanted less to save money, but >> Oh, okay. The money angle. >> Then all of a sudden people started screaming at him. >> So, >> my kid can't get in, >> right? So, now they want it. And we've only had one year of data doing this. So, you know, to to take for us to take a 50 or 70% reduction is, you know, it's

ridiculous. >> Okay. >> Any thoughts on from the the school committee on all of this from a financial perspective? I mean, each kid's what, 25,000 bucks? >> Yeah. Yeah. round above. >> Okay. What else? That's it. Um for the planning board and the advisory hasn't met yet. So, >> okay, >> Brian Fox and Rick, that's right. Oh, >> you can get you got the source. But um the uh this past weekend uh even though

the weather wasn't cooperative on Friday and Saturday let's say I think the booers felt that they had a good weekend at least that's the email I received >> right yeah >> and uh no one's taking uh they feel like you know they actually donated some stuff with the wob goblin >> they usually do that yeah so I don't know what the field looks like yet won't know for a couple days I imagine uh But hey, put money in the boosters uh pocket. That's less money we have to put up with. I'm okay with that. >> Yeah. All right. So, yeah. I mean, you don't know how how did they do this this past weekend? >> No, I don't think the numbers are >> No, I don't we >> I did talk to Jonathan today.

He said that, you know, it looked like he didn't have an exact number, but I said enough that it's still worth it for you to come back. And he said yes. >> Well, he's got $100 of mine. have any kids with you? I was shopping. >> That was just food. Um, so good enough that they probably will come back next year. >> And I my my impression from Amy was that she's prepared to do it. >> You're right. She's signed up. >> That was the important thing is finding that volunteer. >> Should have all their stuff gone after school time went or off the field, I think. >> Okay. All right. from back it up. >> Then we can check the field to see.

>> Okay. What's happening? >> Um I think we've heard enough about the finance committee. >> Yeah. from um the uh school committee. Um they we talked about um the uh cost value u value engineering that they've been doing. Um and um they've the numbers we've been been dealing with are are post value engineering. Um there are still other things that they can do.

Um they're back and forth on a facilities director, which is something we might look at helping them with because um they had had a facilities director and they weren't happy. They had a guy who did a lot of stuff and who could be really hands-on and he was much more interested in the hands-on than in the managing the facilities. Um there has been talk in the past about finding some way that that um the school and DPW could share a person who is a manager um and not a worker. Um

>> add that to the shared services listed discussion. >> Um and now the bridge is fall between the two schools is falling down. There's asbestos in the Essex school. >> Um, >> I'm not surprised that >> that's >> But this bridge here is falling down. >> That bridge there >> where it is. >> Yeah. >> I don't know that it's falling down. It It's been damaged, but it gets run into pretty regularly. >> Fix that with the street. Put the street. >> Yeah. That's why we the road >> where the trucks got higher. >> Yeah. >> Oh, all right. It's a little bit of a dip. Yeah.

But at least that was what I heard from them. Um the >> board of health had a discuss had a presentation by the um woman who is who is coordinating the two groups, the Gloucester and Manchester boards of health on um with the grant money that the state has given us to try and pull groups together. Um, what I heard in previous meetings from the board of health was that they were getting nowhere with the with the uh um turning the all of their boxes of records into um electronic records.

And she seemed to think that they were doing a a better job than that. Um and that that she had a chart. Should send it to you, Kathy. U of and and you know they're they're making progress. It's just that right now they're in a hard place where they have to work with the electronic records and the paper records at the same time and nobody there. Somebody needs to own the responsibility to digitize it and make it happen. >> Yeah. >> But everybody there owns lots of other responsibilities too. >> Yeah. Yeah. That's that's the >> Yeah, >> it's always the last thing that happens, you know. >> Well, I think it would be great if they could

get the records um into electronic form. >> It might be a good task for if they're open to it, reaching out to some schools, you know, co-ops. Uh they've got a they've got a co-op who's currently doing quality control on the um this is not just a question of of of scanning stuff. You have to do you have to build indexes and the >> I mean are we going to solve this or that's just an issue? >> So >> it's an issue. >> So that's what I've been doing. >> Um let's see. Downtown Improvement meets on Wednesday morning. Um, we did make a connection with them, uh, Paige Journey

from the Downtown Improvement Committee, uh, with the MBTA because they wanted to help figure out a way to make the train station a little more welcoming. Apparently, it's um, unwelcoming trash collection. There was a problem. You know, you get off the train, you you don't feel like this is beautiful Manchester. I'll just say it that way. So I made a connection with them uh and the NBTA, but I was wondering do we have an someone here in town hall who's responsible for being the focal point for anything NBTA like for operational >> myself and and depends on really what they're usually it falls to myself and Chuck because usually it's like a you know some sort of >> Yeah, it's not something like that.

That's more just the cleanliness and ask who do we ask for permission to put um you know signs on the the shack there etc the shelter. Okay. So Paige Journey is the one that's working it for the downtown improvement committee. I'll see what they want to do on Wednesday and >> connect me page. >> Okay. >> Um >> is there anything they've done in other places that they're trying to like other towns have done to beautify these things? that our biggest issue with the Manchester station is we don't know who owns what and who's responsible for what. You know, part of it may be the town, part of it may be well, Jim Brown usually goes to these meetings, so he knows what his building area stops, etc.

But getting real clarification on who owns responsibility for what is is like the first step. So, I think that's something that, you know, if you and Paige have a discussion on that, that can help. And then um you know the downtown improvement committee is willing to do some work to help with that. You know put in some volunteer hours on that. Um excuse me. At tomorrow's meeting we're having an MBTA advisory to me um committee meeting tomorrow. Mayor Woo was on the agenda. So we'll have to see what happens there. Um let's see. Alder I think the only other thing No, that was it. Bike and ped meets tomorrow. So nothing else on the as >> okay on a couple of thing. The historic district commission that last week or

maybe it was the week before they're looking at a building. Manchester Marine is expanding and wants to put an 8,000 foot building in the historic district on Ashlin Street. And how you make a big warehouse building just like the big red ones they got. They want to build another one so they can put boats in there and work on them in the winter. And how you make that look historic is beyond me. But they're going to try to come up with some ideas. This is uh before the Ashland before you go to the railroad tracks on the right. >> And there's a it's a space where they've just been storing boats, but they winterize and now those boats or at least the boats they want to work on are going to be indoors.

>> That's Crockers or Manchester Marine. >> It's in front of Crocers. >> It's in front of Crockers. Manchester Manchester Marine owns that space and you know the duplex that um is being built there right next to the Greek Revival. >> Yeah. >> Right next to the next lot right after that. So those folks are going to be looking at >> Well, it's kind of an industrial shed. It's kind of between Crockers and the Gothic. >> What's it zoned down there anyway? >> It's Oh, I don't know what the zoning is, but it's an historic district. >> I don't know if it's good starters. someone who's spending $3 million for a condo. >> Okay. They had to know what they were

building, >> right? >> That's their problem to my problem. You know, I mean, they were >> is that I'm not going to >> The view at best was going to be a bunch of shrink wrapped uh sailboats >> and then an empty lot in the summer. And now they're going to have this building and they're they're coming back to the historic district with some ideas about how to make things a little old wood softener. Yeah, I'm not sure how how they approach that, but that's uh that'll be happening. And uh they discussed more about the demo delay project. there is a consultant that um has been hired and they will have a forum I would say in about two weeks >> kind of a for a public forum in

collaboration with the planning board on this is what a demo delay is about. It's just a preliminary activity but they're hoping to angle towards something on the annual meeting agenda as an article in next year. So we're going to start that discussion. Um and the COA they met this past Wednesday. Um I will say one thing they're pulling together are a couple of speakers associ a couple of speakers that can speak to the senior community center. And by the way, you're on the agenda, Cheryl. In other words, we want somebody to speak from the community angle. Maybe somebody from the >> charts and recruit.

>> Well, yes, I would agree and we chatted about that today and I, you know, I made the observation that at least one of the people that's going to be speaking on behalf of the senior community center is Muffin's sister, Mary Perth. It might be a family affair in that regard. We'll see. >> It's hard not to be a that family. >> They're the Willworth and you're stepping on somebody. You're right. So anyway, they're working they're starting to work on that with messaging and and how they want to do. They might be two or maybe three speakers involved with different perspectives on that, but they're they're preparing that. Um, library did not meet and the DPW is no news is no news. Good

news, I guess. Unless you had something to say, Tom. >> Facilities um planning committee meets on Wednesday night. >> So maybe there'll be something there's an overlap there. >> Um consent agenda. Yeah, >> I move that the board approve the consent agenda. >> Second >> comments on any of that. >> Just a question. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Um I thought we had I apologize. I just don't remember wanted to discuss or had discussed whether or not we have enough um memorial benches or longevity benches. I thought the long like the longevity bench project I thought had

been completed. Um, but I guess we still have the ability to do memorial benches and I wasn't sure if >> like how how do we know when we're done? How do we know when we're full? I guess is the right answer. Yes. >> Yes. All the same questions that park and rec committee is asking, but when feel like this application came in kind of before stop. >> So, we kind of have a hold on it now. >> Okay. Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah, I'm not questioning this one in particular. Just >> I got a call today back on it, but same. >> Well, so I think what I'm asking >> last week, you know what I mean? I have

no problem con approving this consent agenda, but I'm wondering if maybe the select board needs to help you by doing something like asking for a projection of where future ones are needed or are we done? What can we do to help you with this? >> Yeah, thank you. So um started with updating our uh um catalog list of where all the memorial ventures are now. We did it maybe five years ago but I haven't really updated it. So one of the committee members now working on updating that. >> Okay. >> The starters and start there in the meantime. >> So you've already put a moratorum in place. Do you need any do you need us to

do that for you? So to have an official moratorum probably would would if I make a motion here would after we approve the consent agenda would >> a moratorum on the bench >> a pause. Yeah. Until the parks and recck committee comes back to us with a recommendation on how to proceed. >> I put maybe just suggest to add it to the next agenda. >> Next agenda. Okay. >> All right. We'll do that. >> Okay. So thank you. All right. So, >> so I think I already made the motion. >> Motion and did we have a second? >> Yeah. >> Jack, >> yes. >> Ryan, >> yes. >> Dan, >> yes. >> Kathy, >> yes. >> John, yes.

>> Thank you very much for your patience. four things. >> Uh so I won't repeat some of a lot of some of the things I were going to say. It's already been mentioned. Um uh on the staffing front, we had we received a lot of good applications for the full-time finance clerk's position and Andrea and Jen are working with Michelle Maloney to go through that initial round of review and and um conduct initial interviews. Uh I also see that we got a lot of good applications for the part-time land clerk uh land use clerk position as well. So Mark is back on Wednesday and him and I will sit down with Michelle Maloney and give that a a first review and then initiate that

interview process. Um was that one full time? >> That's part time. Yeah. >> Uh the the health department had successful flu clinic. Um also shout out to Wendy for achieving her certified health officer um certification from state. Uh Cheryl obviously mentioned you mentioned a lot of the different things that are going on in the recreation uh department. Um, fire department also is in fire prevention week. They had a successful chili cookoff last weekend. Um, between the fire department, the

police department, and the harbor department, we're still going over afteraction reports of the uh harbor incident. Again, uh can't say enough about that team, you know, the the three three of them and our partnership with our neighboring communities, but uh the training that they have really stepped up in the past year was put to the test and it proved to be very beneficial. So, um the operation of that uh emergency response was very well done. So, we have a uh an afteraction meeting with our neighboring communities uh later this week to kind of talk about lessons learned. Um in the DBW,

uh we have the Bennett Street, Pine Street intersection community meeting coming up on November 4th. Um >> so, when are those invitations going out? I think they've been I think it's been put out there already, but >> I didn't get one. >> I think it was in the tide. >> Um >> see it in the tide. >> There's a there's a Bennett Street, Pine Street community organization >> that intersection part of the part of the design work that we're working on now with the utilities is also look at the road roadway. So, >> okay, >> that that is a >> Yeah. >> When is it supposed to be? >> November 4th. >> I'm going to revisit the roundabout.

another roundabout. >> I think I think this is it makes sense to revisit the topic because of the future Bennett Street construction. >> So, it came up at the downtown improvement committee. We agreed with the DPW and they're ready to talk about it. We we have a an email list that we want to send people invitations to. That I don't believe has been done yet. So, I'll check with the folks in the downtown. >> All right, then. Maybe that >> and then um yeah, because they wanted whatever we want to do to improve, we want to get neighborhood feedback this time. Okay. So, we don't have another roundabout. And >> and uh >> how long did it last? >> Oh, god. Too long. Even I remember that.

>> It's about a week. So, >> it was about a week. Yeah. >> I think the first time a tractor trailer truck couldn't make it, they said, "Nope, we're done." >> Yeah. um Tapen Street uh construction and Atwater construction on the utilities there should be starting in the next month and also next month the culvert will likely go out to bid again that the culvert project won't happen over the fall uh over the winter um it's possible that we could do some of the sill brook restoration over the summer spring summer fall and then the goal would be to get into the culvert replacement next winter. Um,

we talked already about the capital budgets and the operating budget process. The uh finance department is has been going through with those with the completion of those contracts. They've had with a holiday uh and union retro pay. They've had quite a lot of uh work on their plate getting that out the door. Uh I reached out to Senator Tar's office to put us in touch with Masdot to potentially discuss an arrangement of uh an agreement or partnership with Masdot and their fuel depot at their facility. Um, I think that that could certainly provide more res uh, you know, resilience for us and then also maybe some cost savings rather than being dependent on the gas stations here and

obviously we're subject to their operational hours. Um, Essex also recently built a fuel depot that could be an alternative secondary look at something like that. Um we had at the IT collaborative meeting with Danverse uh they came here went to all the communities and did a little bit of an analysis and they found some common areas of improvement. A lot of that has to do with records retention >> which I knew you would >> please please talk to me before you do it. Um, a lot of it too is training on the existing softwares, not not properly utilizing even Microsoft 365. You know,

we have a lot of tools that we've >> we don't take full advantage of. >> Um, the So, we're going to have a select board meeting on the 23rd. It's the Monday after >> annual uh a special town meeting. >> November 23rd. >> November 23rd. Normally we would be meeting on the 16th, but we have special town meeting. So that's the Monday of Thanksgiving. Hopefully that's not an issue for for all of us. Um we'll we that's being timed up with the bond anticipation note results uh meeting that we have to do every year. And tomorrow I'm meeting with Jen and Andrea and Dave to look at what that

setting the tax rate public hearing timeline looks like as well. If we could do them both the same night, that'd be great. I will let you know. Um, let me see here. Oh, uh, also, uh, Mary Miner, our Council on Aging director, uh, if you don't know, she she did get certifi a certified Shine um, representative and she has been inundated with with uh, appointments. She's had 22 people scheduled for the end of the month. >> Thanks. >> Um, and there's a big deadline coming up on December 8th. So, uh, she's I think

that's been that was something that we heard from the seniors was very important in the next COA director. So, she got her certification and she's >> going through the motions. >> Yeah. >> Uh, they also started a a grief support group uh in the end of October. It runs for 12 weeks. Seems like they have a lot of interest there. So, the Council on Aging does have a lot of uh different things coming up. Uh this weekend they're hosting the shred day from 9 to 12 in the back lot. It's also the same day as Wobg goblin, same day as the drug takeback uh that the police department hosts and we have early voting. So it'll be a busy busy day here at the town hall

on Saturday. we we reached out to I think we're okay for this upcoming special town meeting. We have 750 of those clickers. Uh, the company does no longer rents additional clickers. Uh, so I think we're okay for this town meeting, but in the it's something that we have to look at that in the future if we ever thought we were going to have more than 750 residents attend, we wouldn't have the ability to just rent more from that. Uh, >> what has been our maximum utilization? >> I think MBTA was nine of nine.

>> Okay. But they want to charge you like 20 plus thousand dollars just for an additional 2003 300 clickers. >> Are we looking at textbased options? Text base like you can send a text message to do. Our first approach was to look at what other communities are using for clickers and see if there's a better way to approach, you know, some sort of inbulk purchasing pricing or sharing some of the same technology. Um I think those were purchased five plus years ago maybe. >> Yeah. Just um if that doesn't pan out um a lot of places use textbased just send a text message. You do the same charts

that as we do at town meeting, but you don't need a special clicker. It operates off of text. >> I'll take that. >> How would you how would you control that? They're they're actually like >> I'm just saying the technology managing it is different. >> You'd have to tie that. >> All right. We're not going to solve a technical issue here. I'm just I'm just there. There are >> Oh, well, I mean, we'll look into conceptually. I understand. It's just >> other options. locations >> raising your hand and counting too. There's always that >> or if you need to have a secret ballot, you can have a piece of paper and walk out. >> That only takes about two hours.

>> We'll we'll be prepared. >> Yes, >> we'll be prepared for, as always, we're always prepared with the old style way of doing ballot votes. Um, >> what is the cost of buying >> 20,000? >> Say 300 clickers. >> It was in the 20 plus thousand to I thought that was a rent. >> Oh, I thought that was to rent. >> Oh, well, and they don't want to rent either. >> They won't rent. >> Oh, so they they're trying to force some newer technology. >> He didn't say. >> He did say, >> "Thank God you're here to straighten me up." >> Did say it. >> Okay. for the first time all night and I can be grateful. >> Also, uh Christine uh Dixon, our our uh

town clerk, achieved her 10 years as a as a clerk and has joined the uh executive board of the uh Massachusetts Clerk's Association. So, >> well, big milestone for her as well. >> Finally placed connections. >> That's all I have. Okay, great. >> Anybody else have anything? >> Motion to return. >> Accept a motion to return. >> Second. >> Second. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. >> Yes. Yes. >> Well, thank you very much for your patience meeting. So, if you want to join again, it's okay to zoom in. >> He's probably good for a while. >> You decide not to run for anything. >> What did you think?

that I have to do this for. >> We definitely It's good to know how things rock. >> Okay, so one of us can help. >> Well, good. >> We're glad to have you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you very much. >> Going forward. He's very sharp and he's put it the safety